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More fun with my Honda Scooter.

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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts

Posted - 02/07/2012 : 21:39:41

I have been in the market for a bigger motor cycle for a couple months but did not want to invest in a new toy until I got my CH80 sorted out. It is a very simple machine but also very tight quarters for my big old hands. I determined that I needed a new bi-starter fuel enrichment module but found a brand new carb that included the bi-starter for less than I could buy the part. I installed it and the scooter started up great and ran very well. Once it was warmed up I adjusted the idle speed with the throttle stop screw (2). I would ride it a bit and then find that it was surging against the brake so I would screw the stop screw out and get the Rpm down to an acceptable level but the next time I stopped the engine would die. I finally found what I thought was the sweet spot and put the scooter away for the night. When it cooled overnight it absolutely refused to start unless I backed the throttle stop out all the way. Once started I went through the same thing again. the Carb has only two adjustments.

The air screw (1) which is set at the factory and fitted with a collar to limit field adjustments to about 7/8 turn in or out. Then there is the throttle stop (2). There are no other adjustments internal or external. Today I noticed that the idle RPM would increase if I pushed with a little pressure on the side of the carb and would die immediately if I pulled out with slight pressure. I figured I must have have a loose manifold nut or bad o-ring on the inside allowing air in but spraying WD40 around it did not effect the idle at all. Finally I pulled the fender off so I could see (not sure how I am going to get it back on) and this is what I found. Crack is visible only with downward pressure applied.

It Certainly explains the erratic operations.

Looks like a new manifold and o-ring is in my future...

If I can get this running reliably it is going on the market.

Phil

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin

Cvans

USA
4407 Posts

Posted - 02/08/2012 : 01:04:18

t's funny you mention this because I just posted about intake air leaks on another forum earlier this evening. Your lucky you found it. Good trouble shooting on your part.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

olcowhand

USA
5115 Posts

Posted - 02/08/2012 : 09:47:23

Sorry I didn't think of that Phil. When I did cycle/atv repair on the side, I found a lot of cracked manifolds. Guess my brain is getting rusty.......or cracked! LOL

Daniel in Ky -- So much to do, so little time!

Richard L.

USA
483 Posts

Posted - 02/08/2012 : 10:00:23

I'm not seeing it in the pic but I'd think a good dose of black silicone and let the next guy worry about it. It'll probably last forever anyway and would be self explanatory if the guy ever messes with it later.

Cvans

USA
4407 Posts

Posted - 02/08/2012 : 12:34:28

I don't think I would be very happy if someone pulled that on me. I like to sell people things that I know they will be happy with
or at least give them an honest assessment of what they are purchasing. I'm sorry but I don't like being burned.
Silicone is not compatible with with gasoline.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Edited by - Cvans on 02/08/2012 12:36:18

Talntedmrgreen

USA
4110 Posts

Posted - 02/08/2012 : 12:52:29

That looks like a PITA to work on, with the cramped quarters. I run into intake leaks all the time on sleds...probably the #1 issue we see when there is an intermittent issue. Of course, you'd think that would apply when I faced a similar issue on a 16 Briggs, but nope. Spent weeks and lots of $$ trying to figure it out before finding a leak right at the manifold/block.

Gald you found...hope the replacement don't hurt too bad ($$)

skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts

Posted - 02/09/2012 : 20:36:18

Well I'm kinda crazy about wanting things to work right. Even though I don't smoke and I don't want anyone smoking in my car I will replace the cigarette lighter if I discovered that it did not work.

Phil

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin

skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts

Posted - 02/18/2012 : 17:45:50

I finally got in my air tube, I called a manifold, and proceeded to install it. Getting a good purchase on the inboard nut that holds on the carb required my removing the exhaust and fender then deflating the rear tire and compressing with a heavy duty zip tie. Still there is only enough room for 1/6 th turn even with a shorty wrench.

Once I got it off the problem was most evident.

I installed the new tube with o-ring and this is where my being too lazy to get up off the floor cost me.
Got it all back together and it absolutely refused to start. I checked the spark and it was fine. I applied a vacuum to the vacuum activated petcock and the fuel flowed freely but not a pop until I sprayed carb cleaner in the throat and she cranked right up. I proceeded to to tear it down again and sure enough the o-ring was out of position because I was being lazy and did not get up and go out to my POL shed to get a dab of grease to hold it in the groove. This time I did it right and put the film of grease on the o-ring and put it back together again. This time it cranked right up and seemed to warm up properly at which point I was able to adjusted the idle screw to the proper RPM. The idle seems to be nice and steady now but now I need to give it 2-3 hours to cool down to see if it will crank up properly from the current setting. If it does it looks like I finally have it sorted out and can put it on the market.

Phil

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin

olcowhand

USA
5115 Posts

Posted - 02/18/2012 : 21:45:20

Good deal, and good detective work!

Daniel in Ky -- So much to do, so little time!

skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts

Posted - 02/18/2012 : 21:52:17

I just went out and tried it again and it cranked right up. I'll give it another try in the morning to see if I got it right. If it clears off I may try it on the streets tomorrow.

Phil

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin

Cvans

USA
4407 Posts

Posted - 02/19/2012 : 00:27:06

Now that you have all the bugs out of it don't you think you should ride it a little while? Would be nice to get some enjoyment out of it as a pay back for your work. That nice color is going to be hard to replace.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

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