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 Scooter stopped running today. (update)		  New Topic  Reply to Topic
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/24/2011 :  22:03:44  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I was out on my way to the market and the scooter seemed to be running well. It was moving at 45 mph at WOT but when I pulled over to turn into the parking lot it simply died. I managed to get it started and drove around the parking lot and it seemed ok so I went in and got my groceries and came out cranked it right up and drove off into traffic.. After about two miles I made a left hand turn and then accelerated away as normal but when I slowed again to make a turn the engine died again and refused to start leaving me to walk it home the last half mile. I continued to work on it at home. The spark looked weak so I got a new plug and the scooter started right up but died immediately and would not restart. I finally cupped my hand over the air intake and the engine would start and idle as long as I would keep some of the air choked off. It would also run with my hand removed from the intake when the throttle was applied but as soon as I released the throttle it died unless I had my hand back over the intake. BTW the vacuum caused by my hand sucked extra fuel into the throat that ran out on the shop floor. I assume that the low speed circuit is screwed up but don't know where to go from here. It is carburetored with and starter enrichment module rather than choke.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
Edited by - skunkhome on 11/25/2011 19:35:03

Cvans

USA
4407 Posts
Posted - 10/24/2011 :  23:17:59  Show Profile Send Cvans a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Dang grinches are at work again. Could be water in the fuel. Can you get the bottom off of the carb?

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/24/2011 :  23:41:17  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cvans

Dang grinches are at work again. Could be water in the fuel. Can you get the bottom off of the carb?
It is awfully tight but I believe there is a drain screw. I think any thing beyond that will require removing the carb which in itself takes a bit of magic or special tools or removal of the engine first.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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Cvans

USA
4407 Posts
Posted - 10/24/2011 :  23:56:30  Show Profile Send Cvans a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd say your headed in the right direction. When you get it cleaned out if it wasn't water it might be worth installing an inline filter if there is room. Sounds pretty tight though.
Good luck.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  00:02:03  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is room for a filter... strangely enough in the 23 years it was made it had a filter only one year 1985.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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Cvans

USA
4407 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  11:14:01  Show Profile Send Cvans a Private Message  Reply with Quote
That is kind of odd. I suppose there is screen in the fuel valve.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  17:32:26  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is a screen and I opened the drain and what looked like pure gas came out then stopped. I came back and pulled the gas line and could get nothing through the line. I wonder if there is an electric shut-off valve below the tank, but I get no flow even with ignition on.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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K1dan

USA
140 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  18:01:40  Show Profile  Visit K1dan's Homepage Send K1dan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Some bikes have a vacuum operated fuel valve. If you have the vacuum fuel valve it will have three positions. On-RES-Pri. If it is an old style valve It will have On-RES-Off. Often there will be a screen filter in the tank connected to the valve. It could be plugged.
Together we can do anything.. The impossible just takes longer!
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  19:33:40  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by K1dan

Some bikes have a vacuum operated fuel valve. If you have the vacuum fuel valve it will have three positions. On-RES-Pri. If it is an old style valve It will have On-RES-Off. Often there will be a screen filter in the tank connected to the valve. It could be plugged.
I have figured out that it does in fact have a vacuum activate auto petcock. I spent some time looking for my vacuum pump and finally gave up and applied a vacuum with my mouth. I don't like doing that but it did let down fuel when i applied a vacuum. I am pretty sure at this point that the problem is actually in the carb itself and is not a fuel tank or line issue.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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olcowhand

USA
5115 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  19:48:03  Show Profile  Visit olcowhand's Homepage Send olcowhand a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You should be on the right track. I'm sure you'll let us know what you find when you crack open that carb.

Daniel in Ky -- So much to do, so little time!
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 10/25/2011 :  19:59:28  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Of the few times I have worked on carbs I have only been successful about 50% of the time. My last attempt at a Briggs carb left me with a carb with new parts flooding worse the ever. After three miserably failed attempts I finally broke down and bought a new one. Sweet Allis thanks me every time I fire her up.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 11/11/2011 :  20:00:48  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I took my scooter out to a local shop on October 26th and left it to get an estimate of repairs. Today they finally called me and told me that it needed a new front tire and that the spark was ok as we'll as the compression but it needed carb work and should have the gas tank cleaned (nothing I did not know already with the exception of the tank which I have inspected and found to be in great shape). Total cost would be $485 I told them I had a tire and would change myself , and that the plug was brand new. so it was reduced to $385. They told me that it would be $135. In parts and $250 in labor. I will be picking it up tomorrow morning un repaired. I think for that kind of money I can learn to repair the carb. I have already looked into the parts he told me and I can get them for less than a third of the cost they quoted. I have studied the service manual and there really is not that much to the repair. If I am not successful I will part it out. I think they are so busy they think they can charge you anything they like and not miss you if you say no.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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Cvans

USA
4407 Posts
Posted - 11/11/2011 :  20:59:16  Show Profile Send Cvans a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Horse Pucky! That's a lot of money. Maybe if you moved away from Beverly Hills it wouldn't be so costly.
Did you tell them you just wanted yours fixed, not buy a new one?
Looks like a new bike is in the future. A 250 if I remember correctly.

East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
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skunkhome

USA
12827 Posts
Posted - 11/11/2011 :  21:50:28  Show Profile Send skunkhome a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Wife was pleased to learn I wasn't going to get it fixed. But was disappointed that I intended to do it myself. She worked the emergency room while in nursing school and said they had so many accident victims that were horrendous so she would just as soon it never ran again.

Phil



"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."

Benjamin Franklin
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olcowhand

USA
5115 Posts
Posted - 11/11/2011 :  22:34:55  Show Profile  Visit olcowhand's Homepage Send olcowhand a Private Message  Reply with Quote
They planned to ream you out good didn't they! All it should cost is some time & a can of carb cleaner spray. Patience is the main ingredient.

Daniel in Ky -- So much to do, so little time!
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Cvans

USA
4407 Posts
Posted - 11/11/2011 :  23:49:45  Show Profile Send Cvans a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I don't know if I could have been able to even comprehend that price. Honestly can't imagine how I would have reacted.
My wife was a first responder and one of the training films was called "Death on two wheels". Just happened to be on an evening when I went along with her. Not the sort of film that the general public sees. That was nasty. If they ever come out with one called "death with two wings" I will probably quit flying. My wife has been supportive of my flying but is real leery of motorcycles so I know where your coming from.


East Central South Dakota

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
Edited by - Cvans on 11/11/2011 23:50:50
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